Richard Pajerski (Comments)

Re: LS2J as an applet replacement

Richard Pajerski — Fri, 31 May 2024 06:35:40 -0400

Hi Fredrik - thanks for your comments! I've only tried this in Notes 14, FP1 so far but I do have LS2J running in a production 32-bit R12 client environment (although without any Swing components).

Re: LS2J as an applet replacement

Richard Pajerski — Fri, 31 May 2024 06:34:43 -0400

Hi Jesper -- thanks for your comments! That's a clever workaround with the timer! I agree with you on the advantages of Swing in Notes and it's helped me make the business case for Notes/Domino in projects that would have otherwise left the platform.

Re: LS2J as an applet replacement

Fredrik Norling — Fri, 31 May 2024 05:56:39 -0400

Interesting way of doing this, have you tried in in version 12 and 14?

Re: LS2J as an applet replacement

Jesper Kiaer — Fri, 31 May 2024 03:56:49 -0400

Hi, nice :-) I have been using Java Swing in Notes clients for many years, which given me UI options I do not have in the Notes Client. As a work around to issue of JFrame hiding behind the the Notes Client, i user a timer which brings the dialog to front at an interval. /Jesper Kiaer

Re: Domino/Notes 14 and Java in the client

Richard Pajerski — Fri, 28 Jul 2023 10:54:37 -0400

Hi Stephan -- Thanks for your comments! Well, I think it makes sense for HCL to deprecate applet usage in Notes/Domino given their obsolescence for browsers and the fact that the Java platform itself will be removing them. I suppose that's probably their plan -- I'm just not sure how/when that's going to take place. Hopefully there will be some official communication about this soon (would be nice for migration planning).

Re: Domino/Notes 14 and Java in the client

Stephan — Fri, 28 Jul 2023 10:26:42 -0400

What would you do? Spend a huge amount of effort to support applets that the rest of the world has abandoned or use that effort for performance and innovation?

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Richard Pajerski — Thu, 29 Dec 2022 11:46:13 -0500

Hi Daniel -- I appreciate your input. I ended up using the scheduled tasklet approach (with some polling) which is working great and a much better option than my previous Java agent. However, I'd really like to use the triggered approach -- it seems cleaner overall for my use case.

What exactly is wrong with the way the current extension manager is written? If there are known problems, one would hope that HCL would put a proviso in the documentation somewhere...

Does the "initial contributor" you spoke with work at HCL or have some sway there? :-)

By the way, it's Ok to post more than 1,000 characters in your comments -- the blog simply marks it as SPAM but doesn't delete it.

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Daniel Nashed — Thu, 29 Dec 2022 04:54:44 -0500

Another second part reply:

I spoke with one of the initial contributors of the DOTS project and he said that the hook/extension manager code was more experimental, than ready to be released. And he did not know anyone using it in production.

Not sure which use case you have in mind. But I would use a different approach. Since this approach isn't scalable and isn't completely real time.

I have written highly optimized Extension Managers for special needs. But in most cases polling checking database modified time before searching works well.

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Daniel Nashed — Thu, 29 Dec 2022 04:50:08 -0500

Your post says "Windows 2019" is causing the problem. Sounds like you only have a problem with the space in the installation path?

To understand how the trigger works, you have to understand the underlying technology in detail. Hook drivers and Extension managers capture any update.

Hook drivers should not used at all and might not be reliable not catching all event types. Extension Managers in contrast are fully supported.
But In this case the extension manager isn't written in the right way. It captures just all events for Note update + many other events and sends them to DOTS via the MQ. DOTS has to filter them.

So I can't recommend to use either way! The Hook driver nor the Extension Manager should have been added, when DOTS came back.

I spoke with one of the initial contributors of the DOTS project and he said that the hook/extension manager code was more experimental, than ready to be released.

Not sure which use case you have in mind. But I would use a different approach. Since this approach isn't scalable and isn't completely real time.

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Richard Pajerski — Mon, 26 Dec 2022 11:27:31 -0500

Hi Daniel --

The first half of my post deals with the space in the program installation directory. I opened a case for that with HCL and they said they could reproduce the problem. That case is still open but they haven't created an SPR yet (they're still researching it). There's not much more to the ticket other than that it's easy to reproduce the problem: simply "load dots" from a Domino server console. The "TriggeredExample" sample tasklet (which ships with Domino 12) doesn't show any console output when there's a space present in the installation directory but *does* show output when the space is removed.

The second half of the post -- about triggered events in general on an installation *without* spaces -- is a separate issue. I don't think the two are directly related. Your point about the 1:1 updates was also my assumption when I started testing the event triggers but my results show that some events never get sent to the tasklet.

Thanks again for your comments!

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Daniel Nashed — Sun, 25 Dec 2022 05:11:15 -0500

Thanks for the clarification. You are assuming some details. I am not an expert about the DOTS task itself.
But from what it looks like a NSF Hook driver is intercepting the low level Domino call-backs (hook drivers are similar to Extension Manager events).
The hook driver opens the DOTS own MQ for communicating with the DOTS tasks (sending an event with the data).

Hooking into the low level updates for documents isn't 1:1 compared to Lotus Script or Java. You might get more events. But not less.

Domino process where HOOK Driver is loaded --> Captured Event --> MQ Open to send event data --> DOTS task reads from MQ and triggers action.

I don't see where Windows 2019 could make a difference here.
Is there already a SPR? Can you share your details of the ticket offline?
You got my mail address from my post.

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Richard Pajerski — Sat, 24 Dec 2022 20:34:29 -0500

Hi Daniel - thanks for your comments! To be clear, to test this, I'm using a one-line annotated method in a Java tasklet:

public class DotsTesting extends AbstractServerTask {

   @Triggered(eventId={IExtensionManagerEvent.HOOK_EVENT_NOTE_UPDATE} /*500*/)

    public void runHook(NSFHookNoteUpdateEvent evt, IProgressMonitor arg1) throws NotesException {

       logMessage("Note hook update in " + evt.getDbPath());

   }

}

So I'm testing using plain Java with out-of-the-box DOTS. The logMessage call (which itself just calls System.out.println()) doesn't print anything. My reference to the C++ code was a suggestion after browsing backward through src/com/ibm/dots at OpenNTF (which I think is ultimately where IExtensionManagerEvent leads to).

Best,
Richard

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Daniel Nashed — Sat, 24 Dec 2022 17:57:46 -0500

2nd part of my message:

I don't see why Windows 2019 should make a difference. This might be a coincident and your problem might have a different root cause.
And I would add logging in the code effected before opening the MQ and there should be error logging around all calls.

But as long the MQ is available, this open request should not fail.
And as long the events are not overloaded (a MQ has a limit of 64K) there is no reason why it should fail.

So I would look for the root cause more around the hook driver.

Re: Possible bug with triggered NSFDBHOOK events in DOTS (on Windows 2019)

Daniel Nashed — Sat, 24 Dec 2022 17:56:57 -0500

The NSF Hook technology is a quite old technology, which has been replaced by Extension ;Manager technology long time ago.
I am surprised there is still software using it.

Message Queues (MQ) are a core functionality in Notes/Domino used in many places of Notes/Domino for process to process communication. What would you do when this fails? For sure there should be logging and an application could try to keep events and try again. But this is this should be a real time event and delaying it, would not be expected by the application.

For sure there should be proper error logging to find out why an event is not captured. But I would more look into issues with the hook driver technology and I would replace it with extension manager technology.

Re: Java applets in Notes 64-bit client not loading

Glen — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 11:00:50 -0500

Hi Richard,

it's detailed in SPR#PSHECLULWM "Embedded views only show first category"
https://support.hcltechsw.com/csm?id=kb_article&sys_id=c0a011261b6b5154574121f7ec4bcb6c

Re: Java applets in Notes 64-bit client not loading

Richard Pajerski — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 08:43:01 -0500

Hi Glen -- thanks for the tips! Can you elaborate on the embedded view problems?

Re: Java applets in Notes 64-bit client not loading

Glen — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 03:26:01 -0500

More worryingly : "Array of Longs in LotusScript on a 12.0.2 64-bit client is not working"
https://support.hcltechsw.com/csm?id=kb_article&sys_id=c66d8bfa1b5f5d50a67e9759bc4bcb2c
I think the 64 bit version should still be viewed as a beta.
However, the main reason we won't be rolling out 12.0.2 is that embedded views are not working properly in 32 or 64 bit.

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Richard Pajerski — Mon, 16 Aug 2021 13:49:12 -0400

Hi Michal -- thanks for your comments and I'm pleased this post helped you, too!

Good question regarding refreshing the Inbox -- I do have the same problem and yes, it's been there for a long time. A fundamental issue is that there's no client-side hook into the "You have new mail" notification (as far as I know). An "After new mail has arrived" agent won't work for at least two reasons: 1) that trigger is server-based only and 2) there's no practical way to directly refresh the UI from such an agent anyway (this also rules out a locally-scheduled agent).

Potential avenues to explore would be a Notes plugin or some client-side Javascript to refresh the Inbox say every 30 seconds.

Best,
Richard

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Michal — Mon, 16 Aug 2021 11:07:57 -0400

Hello Richard,
it seems that you - like myself - are using Notes as a POP3 client with the local mail file. I guess not too many people use Notes client in this way.
So maybe you also came across a problem with automatic refreshing of an Inbox after replicator runs and fetches new e-mails via POP3. Automatic refreshing worked in this scenario even in version R5, but when I tried v10, v11 and now v12 - I have to refresh Inbox manually.
Maybe you've got it working somehow?

Kind regards,
Michal

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Michal — Mon, 16 Aug 2021 03:58:51 -0400

Thank you Richard for finding this solution! I was struggling with this for a few days and tried almost all the tricks you described, but not this final one :)

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Richard Pajerski — Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:58:33 -0400

Hi Oliver -- my pleasure, and good to hear this helped you, too! I hadn't considered opening a ticket with HCL but since the bug appears to be in the (proprietary) Notes client code, only they'd be able to fix it.

Thanks for your comment,
Richard

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Oliver Busse — Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:02:07 -0400

Hey Richard,

I saw this once you posted it - now I had to try it out and it works like a charm!
Thank you for digging into it and sharing this very useful workaround!
I guess this is worth a case for HCL, right? ;-)

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Richard Pajerski — Mon, 21 Jun 2021 23:41:08 -0400

Hi Amit -- You're welcome, glad you found this useful! This probably affects previous versions of the Notes client as well but I haven't taken the time to investigate.

Best,
Richard

Re: Notes client pegs one logical processor at 15%

Amit Sharma — Mon, 21 Jun 2021 22:35:43 -0400

Thanks a lot for sharing this useful information.

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Nigel — Tue, 6 Oct 2020 03:18:54 -0400

Hi Richard

Thanks for this, I have been off work for a couple of weeks so will try this and let you know the results.
I installed sametme on the primary domino server and still have the same problem I was having on the separate sametime server, so must be related.

Thanks

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Richard Pajerski — Tue, 22 Sep 2020 17:34:54 -0400

Nigel -- If you're using an Internet Site document, one other thing you might try is adding the following two lines to your server's sametime.ini in the [AuthToken] section:

ST_ORG=<Your Domino Organization's abbreviated name>
ST_TOKEN_TYPE=LtpaToken

Extending my example above, my sametime.ini has:
[AuthToken]
ST_ORG=TestLab
ST_TOKEN_TYPE=LtpaToken

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Richard Pajerski — Wed, 9 Sep 2020 09:42:04 -0400

Hi Nigel --

I've not tried to run Verse on the same machine as Sametime, but in theory it should work as long as you use different ports. I'd suggest running Verse on default port 443 and Sametime on 8443. So your web and mobile users will access chat at sametime.internal.co.uk:8443.

Looking forward to hearing how this goes.

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Nigel — Wed, 9 Sep 2020 03:33:29 -0400

Hi Richard,

Thanks for this, I will give it a go I think as only have less than 100 users, so not really a lot of users.
Like I said only setup a new server to get running on server 2019. I can give it a go and then roll out if it works.
Will it cause problems if verse and http services are running on the server as well.

Will update with my results when I get a chance to do it.

Thanks

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Richard Pajerski — Tue, 8 Sep 2020 12:15:59 -0400

Hi Nigel --

No problem, I don't mind the questions!

If you only need the capacity of one server, then you should install Sametime 11 on the same server as Domino 11. You can get Sametime working on multiple servers (with Domino server clustering) but that is a more complicated setup and should only be considered if you need to support thousands of concurrent connections.

For a single server setup, no, you don't need any additional configuration for Directory Assistance, etc. Also, since the architecture changed with Sametime 11 and WebSphere server is no longer needed, the documentation for releases 8.x through 10 is (generally) no longer relevant for Sametime 11 installations.

Although the Sametime 11 server isn't officially supported under Windows 2012 it may work fine there (test first, but I've managed to get it working successfully even on a Windows 8 Pro client as a proof of concept in a non-production environment).

Re: Sametime 11 with Proxy Server -- installation notes

Nigel — Fri, 4 Sep 2020 08:01:50 -0400

I wanted set it up on the same machine but I set up the sametime server as a new server as it requires server 2016/19 and the main domino server is still on server 2012.
The users will not be able to enter the AD domain address as this not available outside the organisational network, where as I can add sub-domains to our public domain names to point to the sametime server like chat.externaldomain.com.

I think it doesn't help when setting up mongo, sametime and proxy etc. using the out of date instructions from HCL, I was unsure when entering the address/name it meant AD name or FQDN, local, loopback or public IP.

It would probably all work if our internal AD Domain had the same name as our web domain name.

So apart from doing all the things in HCL instructions and any additional settings like you have stated, does anything need to be done, so a fresh windows server install, update, join domain, install and set-up Domino server, MongoDB, sametime, proxy using all the proper steps.

Are there any changes to the other non-sametime primary domino server needed at all. I was reading about Directory Assistance and other things and replicating things from one to the other, end up going down rabbit holes reading for hours, on things about 8.5, 9 and 10 versions etc.

Sorry for bombarding you, but you seem to have a good knowledge of this.